The Pacific Eye

Interview with Dr. Selena Tusitala Marsh
	"You guys are the generation that will be the most fully equipped to not only 'provide' the 'entertainment' but steer it, own it, produce it."

Dr. Selina Tusitala Marsh is of Samoan, Tuvaluan, English, Scottish and French descent. She is the first Pacific Islander to graduate with a PhD in English from Auckland University where she is an English Professor teaching New Zealand and Pacific Islander literature. She has published numerous poems addressing critical issues in relation to Pacific Islander experiences. Her most recent work focuses on the challenges and triumphs around what it means to be afakasi.

Even with her very busy schedule Dr. Marsh made the time to answer Pacific Eye Magazine’s inquiries about her poetry, her writing style, and her love of learning.

PEM: What inspired you to write the poem “The Young and the Restless” and what audience did you have in mind?
Dr. Marsh: I was doing research for my Master's thesis which examined the film comedies of Whoopi Goldberg. In the process I started thinking about why, of all the available topics, it was that I was drawn to this one. It was because at the time (1992), that was the closest popular representation on TV/film that I, as a Polynesian woman, could identity with: Black American popular culture. We've come so far (or have we?), but at the time, her boundary crossing as 'black' and as woman a society predominantly controlled by 'white' power brokers was something I could relate to.

PEM: Why do you think there are such limited representations of us as Pacific Islanders in the mainstream media and how can we disrupt these bounded representations?
Dr. Marsh: I think as Pacific Islanders gain more control over our creative processes, and pull the strings of power behind the scenes, that we'll see more validating representations of us on screen. I can't emphasize this enough. You guys are the generation that will be the most fully equipped to not only 'provide' the 'entertainment' but steer it, own it, produce it etc. At a recent Pacific Arts panel in Christchurch, Albert Wendt was asked what he thought about the stereotypes being perpetrated in Bro' Town (NZ first primetime animated show). His response was enlightening. He said that it wasn't so much what the Naked Samoans were doing that bothered him, but about how they gave their power away. The third season is being written by a pakeha woman. Because their creative power wasn't properly protected (in the first season they didn't receive any royalties for the huge flux of promotion products, the lunch boxes, t-shirts, coloring books, etc.) The Naked Samoans have become effectively redundant. They're not needed. They created this popular successful thing, and now its being run (and profited off of) by Palagis!! We can disrupt it by keeping and protecting power over our creativity. We've got to be smart. We've got to be in control. Toa Fraser (director of No. 2) has just accepted a huge contract to direct an American film. He accepted only on the condition that he be the Executive Producer. He's smart and talented.

PEM: What drew you into the field of poetry, literature and education?
Dr. Marsh: For me, poetry is emanicipatory. It expects nothing from me. It allows me to be truly who I am whenever I choose. It is a gift from God, the ultimate Creator. And with that gift comes responsibility to His creation, other people. Poetry has the power to move people, to allow them to think, even if for a moment, about something different, in a different light. That's the beauty of it for me. It moves. It lives. It’s the power of the Word to move, and to heal. I was drawn into literature because I loved reading. I loved escaping into reading, books, film. I didn't like other people's poetry until later in life. It scared me because I couldn't understand it. I couldn't access it. And then I found out there were lots of different types of poetry. The most important thing for me was to keep reading, exploring and exposing myself to other writings. I am the first in my family to attend a university and leave with degrees. Mum couldn't articulate why it was important, but she just knew, like many PI parents, that education was the key to a good life in Niu Sila, and that the sacrifices to come here were worth it if her children received a quality education. I still have to fill out my mum's forms. After 35 years in New Zealand, her English is enough to get by but she continues to struggle with basic literacy. I don't share this with you to put her down. On the contrary, it shows the tenacity of my mother to ensure that I did better, received more, and with excellence. I credit much of my success in education to her. Even though she couldn't help me with the content, she gave me time and space to think at college.

PEM: What do you think is unique about the poetry you create?
Dr. Marsh: I think all poetry is unique. No one has your tongue, your brain, your thoughts, your dreams. No one's walked in your shoes. I think the difference between those who write poetry, and those who may want to, but don't, is fear. I like my poetry because I'm writing to my own experience. I'm a voice in the second generation of PI's writing, creating, in English. My experiences are different from Albert Wendt's, Epeli Hau'ofa's or Konai Helu Thaman's. My experiences are Aotearoa-based and born, afakasi, thiry-something, woman's experiences. I'm writing what I've always subconsciously sought to read!

PEM: You represent many ethnic identities (Samoan, Tuvaluan, English) how do you express all of those identities in your writing?
Dr. Marsh: That question is based on the assumption that our composite identities can be compartmentalized. We don't experience a visit to the zoo as a woman for the first 10 minutes, then a Samoan for the next 10 minutes, then a mum of three boys crashing and smashing against the monkey bars for the next 10. We are holistic beings, our identities are fluid. I like to think of my identities as 'chameoleonic' - they change/adapt according to the context I'm in. Different colors and hues rise to the surface and others submerge in order to best respond to the circumstances. My writing is fluid, changes and adapts according to many things.

PEM: Do you feel it is important to embrace all of our cultural identities?
Dr. Marsh: Absolutely! I've kind of answered that in the previous question, but genealogy has always been of paramount importance in the Pacific and to Pacific ways of thinking. It’s all about asserting your 'turangawaewae', your standing place in the world and your connection to other people. Of course, we prioritize certain blood lines because they reflect our experience in the world. For me, being a Kiwi of Samoan and English descent would most aptly describe how I experience the world. My Tuvalu, German (Samoan) French, and Scottish lines are important, but not as meaningful in my every day experiences. A poem I wrote in 1994 prefacing my first published article served this purpose in an educational atmosphere that intimidated me! I was fearful but knew that even though there were few PIs doing what I was doing, I needed to make this foreign academic space my own. It plays on the fact that Robert Louis Stevenson, part of a European canon that perpetuated disempowering stereotypes of Pacific peoples (though he wasn't as overtly racist as some of his peers), was also known as tusitala (which is my mother's name). Here, I tell a very, very different tale to the world.

Tusitala
teller of tales
that I never heard
till yesterday
born away
for another life
today
the tale I tell
is theirs
and yours
a way of seeking
some more of
Samoa
of my sacred centre
today
the tale I tell
will book its way
through tongued histories
silenced mysteries
sacred silence
timeless lives
tala tusi
tell the book
word the spirit of brown
in theory
in creativity
we make our sound
renown.

PEM: When you create a poem, do you have a specific audience in mind or do you just create with the hopes that others will enjoy it regardless of who they are?
Dr. Marsh: I write for me. I write for release. Many of my best poems are deliberately written with a political agenda in mind, and in a voice that attempts to subvert the status quo - like when I write to disturb common, disempowering stereotypes about Pacific. So, while I do write for 'me', I also know that there are many 'mes' out there who want to hear what I have to say, and might appreciate how I say it.

PEM: What do you feel are the biggest challenges facing our Pacific Islander youth today?
Dr. Marsh: I recently asked Honorable Tui Atua Tupua Tamasese that very question. He replied that it wasn't drugs, or crime, or pregnancy rates or truancy rates. He said it was 'boredom'. I thought long and hard about that and had to agree. Most of us live on the fringe of our passions, IF we're that lucky. People, young and old, need to be captured by that thing God has planted in their hearts that makes them whole. You know it when you do/see/be it because it brings you to the edge of life, you live it in all your rawness, and in those moments, you know there is nothing you'd rather be doing!

PEM: Who has been most influential in your writings?
Dr. Marsh: It’s probably not a 'who' as much as a 'what'. What has been most influential in my writings is the attitude that we are life-long students on this journey, that my mind is always open to learning something new in any circumstance, that the world is my teacher and I can receive wisdom and knowledge in everything from a Bible scripture, to a quip on the back of a cereal box, to a line in my 6 year olds’ poem. I soon realized after getting a PhD, one of the supposedly highest degrees of educational qualification, the true meaning of the wise lyrics of an old UB40 song (ask your teacher who they are): "every hour of every day I'm learning more, the more I know, the less I knew about before, the less I know the more I want to look around, dig in deeper into higher ground". Keep your mind open, your writing is inevitably a mirror of your mind, soul, and heart.

PEM: As a Pacific Islander Female Scholar, Writer, Poet, Educator, what would you like to be the legacy that you leave behind for the next generation?
Dr. Marsh: Those titles sound so important and it’s sometimes hard to recognize myself in them, especially since I've found the mantle of 'role model' thrust upon my shoulders, which I guess was to be expected. I try not to succumb to the pressure that I should be more than who I actually am. One of my most treasured pieces of wisdom comes from the book of Micah where it says that this is what God wants from us: "to be fair and just and merciful, and to walk humbly with your God." I love it so much because it strikes a balance between doing great and wonderful things with your life and for other people, while all the time knowing that you are God's hands, eyes, ears, feet. There's a common saying that 'knowledge comes from books, wisdom comes from God'. This is so true. So the legacy I would want to leave behind is that boundaries can be broken, hearts and minds can be enlightened, people can be empowered, and you can still be a genuine, kind, loving person! I recently saw Will Smith's film based on a true story, 'In pursuit of happyness' and what I most noticed was that no matter what the situation, both the main character and some pivotal key business people in his life, despite or in spite of their various circumstances, were kind, considerate and polite to others. That reminded me that everyone, no matter who, what, or where they come from, deserves their dignity.

PEM: What three books do you feel that every teenager should read before they graduate from high school and why?
Dr. Marsh: 1) 'Where We Once Belonged' by Sia Figiel because she's the first Samoan woman novelist writing for the first time about the intimacies of girl-life in a village setting. It’s an incredible and significant milestone in Pacific Literature.

2) An inspiring biography of some kind - I read Nelson Mandela's. Because there's more to the world than yourself. No person is an island and it’s dangerous to get trapped into feeling that 'you're the only one' in this situation. Taking a temporary peek into the lives of other achievers and 'overcomings' can be incredibly transforming!

3) 'This Present Darkness' by Frank E Pereti. It's a fiction and it revolutionized my spiritual life! Read it and see for yourself! Everything we do has consequences in the spiritual world. This is true for Christians as well as other faiths!

PEM: How can writing become something empowering for our youth?
Dr. Marsh: In 'Towards a New Oceania', a very important essay written by Wendt in the 1970s, he stated in the context of ongoing colonialism in the Pacific :"Self-expression is a pre-requisite to self-respect". I agree. Everyone needs to have their voice, in whatever way, sounded, and heard.

PEM: Any final advice for our youth who are aspiring to become Educators, Writers, Poets?
Dr. Marsh: Face the fear and do it anyway. This piece by Marianne Williamson has always inspired me: “Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is our light, not our darkness that most frightens us. We ask ourselves, Who am I to be brilliant, gorgeous, talented, fabulous? Actually, who are you not to be? You are a child of God. Your playing small does not serve the world. There is nothing enlightened about shrinking so that other people won't feel insecure around you. We are all meant to shine, as children do. We were born to make manifest the glory of God that is within us. It's not just in some of us; it's in everyone. And as we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same. As we are liberated from our own fear, our presence automatically liberates others.”

If you don't see your story/voice/self out there, get it out there -you'd be surprised how many others will have an 'aaha' moment! For example, check out my poem 'Afakasi checklist'. I hadn't read of anyone voicing out about the afakasi experience in NZ before. It was time this story was told!

For more information about Dr. Marsh’s poetry check out the following websites:
http://www.booksellers.co.nz/mpd_poems.htm
http://www.asu.edu/pipercwcenter/how2journal/current/pacific/selina_marsh.html
http://nzpoetsonline.homestead.com/STM16.html
http://www.nzepc.auckland.ac.nz/pasifika/marsh1.asp